Child Rescue or Child Trafficking?

Piedrasalvador · **Child Rescue or Child Trafficking? -** 02-01-2010, 12:56 PM

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100201/...icans_detained

In the current circumstances when all governance systems are further weakened, too much bureaucracy will thwart rescue efforts and kill the passion to want to help. I think these alleged child traffickers should be praised not ridiculed.

Do I make sense? Be sincere with me...

ascona · 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piedrasalvador

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100201/...icans_detained

In the current circumstances when all governance systems are further weakened, too much bureaucracy will thwart rescue efforts and kill the passion to want to help. I think these alleged child traffickers should be praised not ridiculed.

Do I make sense? Be sincere with me...

No! these people may be genuine, but they must follow the proper procedures. If they make it free for all, how can they distinguish the criminals from the well intentioned?

imhotep · 02-01-2010, 04:08 PM

hogwash....they have been caught red handed and they should face the full force of the law...
How were they able to seek permission from the Dominican Govt, but they didn't think they needed permission from the Govt in Port Au Prince?

Because the Haitian Capital has been devastated does not mean the laws of the country has also been scrapped.....

Ignorance of the law is no excuse.......

Do you Remember Congo or Central African Republic.... A Similar organization was caught doing the same thing, snatching children ( calling them orphans) and selling them in France. As it turns out the so called orphans, all of them had parents... parents whom were told we are going to give your child school...

I am providing the link for you to read for yourself.....
http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/africa...had/index.html

so it is not the first time these so called good Samaritan's have capitalize on disasters to rake in profit

theomagnusen · 02-02-2010, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piedrasalvador

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100201/...icans_detained

In the current circumstances when all governance systems are further weakened, too much bureaucracy will thwart rescue efforts and kill the passion to want to help. I think these alleged child traffickers should be praised not ridiculed.

Do I make sense? Be sincere with me...

Nonsense....Haiti is not for sale; Haiti is not a lawless country as they would want us to see it. The Dominican Republic is not Haiti so permission granted there are not legally binding in “chaotic” Haiti.
These day light criminals betrayed their Faith, the little boys and girls of Haiti need better than that.
A very similar incident took place some many months ago down here in the central African Zone, to be precise, Chad. This time around the French Nationals involved alleged that their “goodwill intention” was to fly these kids for adoptions in France and the Chadian courts did indeed proved the devilish intentions of the group beyond reasonable doubt. They were to serve time as determined by the courts, but once again France was able to use its dirty tentacles to cut dirty deal with the Chadian Govt. The Govt was facing attacks by a rebellion group and Her Majesty France stood by Chadian Govt, with military help etc. The France military contingent stationed at N’djamena was to official help the official Chadian Govt. Just after that, the prisoners were realized to serve their sentences in France. This indicates that indeed the French legal system knew that they were criminals.
As the Haitian Prime Minister rightfully said “It is clear now that they were trying to cross the border without papers. It is clear now that some of the children have live parents," …..PiedraSalvador, this is a criminal offense in itself and a felony when you try to steal kids out of their homes.

Piedrasalvador · **rescue or trafficking -** 02-02-2010, 10:34 AM

No!, Hogwash and nonsense comes the rawring....I respect your sentiments. Imhotep produced a link to a good story to justify the rawr but before you lions start devouring, note that you are not leaving the realities of the times in Haiti. You are whipping yourselves with sentimentalism that will be good for other times but not the current situation.

I'll be back. Just reflect on how i'm viewing your reactions maybe we'll come closer....

ascona · 02-02-2010, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piedrasalvador

No!, Hogwash and nonsense comes the rawring....I respect your sentiments. Imhotep produced a link to a good story to justify the rawr but before you lions start devouring, note that you are not leaving the realities of the times in Haiti. You are whipping yourselves with sentimentalism that will be good for other times but not the current situation.

I'll be back. Just reflect on how i'm viewing your reactions maybe we'll come closer....

You should know by now that I don't have time for sentimentalism. Yes, we are not living the realities of Haiti. This is the argument I have made in my previous threads regarding Zimbabwe,Sudan and elsewhere which you won't accept. Notwithstanding that, I hope you will accept that irrespective of their well intention (if is proven) they should have seeked permission from the Haitian authorities. What do you think?

theomagnusen · 02-04-2010, 07:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piedrasalvador

No!, Hogwash and nonsense comes the rawring....I respect your sentiments. Imhotep produced a link to a good story to justify the rawr but before you lions start devouring, note that you are not leaving the realities of the times in Haiti. You are whipping yourselves with sentimentalism that will be good for other times but not the current situation.

I'll be back. Just reflect on how i'm viewing your reactions maybe we'll come closer....

As Mr. Ascona rightfully put it, we have no time for sentimentalism.....we stand for the right and let me say one more time to you...HAITI CHILDREN ARE NOT FOR SALE. Please this is public relations affairs so to speak you get to be sure you have the facts other than playing with the future of Haiti and speaking of a subject matter you obviously know little about.
When Katrina hit the US some years ago, did anyone go to the affected states to kidnap children under the pretext of some goodwill intention?
I think in the least developed countries, sometimes to send animals form one country to another you do need permit, but note we are talking about HUMAN BEING WITH LIVING PARENTS OR RELATIVES.PiedraSalvador, Haiti did not get to where it is today because of the disaster.....it is where it is today because of the long term demonic and devilish doings of these same people who call themselves "good Samaritans" of the west.

imhotep · 02-04-2010, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Piedrasalvador

No!, Hogwash and nonsense comes the rawring....I respect your sentiments. Imhotep produced a link to a good story to justify the rawr but before you lions start devouring, note that you are not leaving the realities of the times in Haiti. You are whipping yourselves with sentimentalism that will be good for other times but not the current situation.

I'll be back. Just reflect on how i'm viewing your reactions maybe we'll come closer....

If all Ghanaian are like you, then i can see why Ghana is not going anywhere... your claim that because there is a disaster, so anything goes is just plain hogwash.....

If these guys were not Americans, they would have been sentenced to death already....The only reason this case is being massaged is because they are Americans..

How do you get permission from Dominican govt to Move Haitian Children? Are the children Dominicans living in Haiti?

From the get go, the Haitian Authorities issued warning to all wanna be adoption, orphanage not to move any Haitian child without the explicit permission of the Prime Minister....

Now, the Dominican Consular has spoken unequivocally... that he told the guys they have no papers to move the children, and doing so would constitute child trafficking....

It also turns out almost all the children are not orphans and in many case both parents are alive and kicking.....

as they say scratch a liar find a thief......These guys are thieves and liars are now are seeking sympathy....

Piedrasalvador · 02-05-2010, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imhotep

If all Ghanaian are like you, then i can see why Ghana is not going anywhere... your claim that because there is a disaster, so anything goes is just plain hogwash.....

If these guys were not Americans, they would have been sentenced to death already....The only reason this case is being massaged is because they are Americans..

How do you get permission from Dominican govt to Move Haitian Children? Are the children Dominicans living in Haiti?

From the get go, the Haitian Authorities issued warning to all wanna be adoption, orphanage not to move any Haitian child without the explicit permission of the Prime Minister....

Now, the Dominican Consular has spoken unequivocally... that he told the guys they have no papers to move the children, and doing so would constitute child trafficking....

It also turns out almost all the children are not orphans and in many case both parents are alive and kicking.....

as they say scratch a liar find a thief......These guys are thieves and liars are now are seeking sympathy....

Excessive bureaucracy, bureaucratic apparatus crafted to benefit the elite, promulgation of unenforceable laws, the deception that law makers are the builders of the nation… etc, are the cause of Ghana’s bane. ….People like me will put things right in five years. You can try me.

Sorry for killing the heat of the debate with my slow responses. They’re unintentional. I trust you’ll understand me.

The story line to which my posted url linked, changed fundamentally the same they. When I posted it the President of Haiti had not sent out the statement that he was now sure the ‘’supposed rescuers’’ knowingly acted against the rules for adoption. In fact the story line within a few hours changed so drastically it was no more as speculative as when I read it for the first time. In that case, I don’t fault my esteemed international relations specialists for roaring nonsense! and hogwash!.

Notwithstanding the change in the story line, my personal position, in principle, remains unchanged.

Note the Haiti President’s earlier comment ‘’ this (the child rescue saga) is a distraction of the recovery efforts’’ paraphrased. I recall one of the suspects also saying that in the mist of all the chaos there was little one could do. I agree with the president and the suspect. Why? The situation can get anyone confused. Where can we find the bureaucratic apparatus that deals with adoption in Haiti after the earthquake? No wonder the president laments the distraction…they were not prepared for such wonderful responses as the suspects did…period!

Let’s put the saga in the context of the Haiti that we know…even before the disaster. Whoever cared about the thousands that perished in waters in their attempt to migrate for juicier pastures? Why would anybody pretend that now they cared so much about the movement of Haitians…more so probable orphans in a country where whole families struggle to make it (I acknowledge they are victims of evil forces). But who ever cared? It is in the same vein, rampant dangerous voyages away from Haiti, that these good Samaritans have thought that before these children suffer even a day more. Let’s whisk some away! To hell with bureaucracy! And remember these people may have their own lives to think about. No time to waste. Rescue is rescue. When you get to accident scene, you see how horribly volunteers perform their rescue missions. Can they wait for the experts to come? What if they (experts) never come? They work based on their pure consciences.

So, granted that some unscrupulous entities have, through similar operation lines, attempted child trafficking, we cannot say for sure that these good Samaritans are child traffickers. I know the justice system shall exonerate them. I rest my case.

And you Lions crying foul…you risk genuine offers with too much suspicion.
Hey you lion Theomagnusen watch your mouth…hm? I have Seven (7) sigma belts in international relations ok? My International lifestyle in Cuba alone gave me 3 belts. I obtained the rest just recently …so watch when you say I don’t know what I’m talking about. You bully!....lol

theomagnusen · 10:50 AM

Mr PiedraSalvador,at this corner we've get to separate sentimentalism from what is lawful and what is illegal.Those alleged good samaritans have the right to have saved those kids but once you try to smuggle them outside their country,then i am sorry to tell you that it is legally attempting to unlawfully kidnap and kidnaping.If you are to go to your dictionary,you would find the difference between rescue and kidnap.The Dominican authorities alerted them but they snubed them because they thought Haiti was in the stone era and therefore it was not even necessary to seek permission before you get human beings out of that country.Who told you the system in Haiti is not operational....once again i implore you to embrace logics and respect for your fellow humans,irrespective of the situation they find themselves.Remember,these Little Flowers of Haiti were victims of a natural disaster,yet these latter-day good samaritans still show their disrespect for humanity is such a disgusting manner.As you said in your reply,who cared all these years about the thousands of Haitian lives lost on the high seas in their quest to seek greener pastures? We don't need latter-day saints and latter-day good samaritans with God's words in one hand and KIDNAPING written all over their bodies.